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Can a big kite turn quickly?

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Created by FormulaNova > 9 months ago, 26 Feb 2019
FormulaNova
WA, 14049 posts
26 Feb 2019 10:20PM
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I have been using my 14m Cabrinah Contra over the last two days, and it is super slow. My 11m turns fine, but this 14m is like you have to send it a fax to tell it to turn and then wait for a while before it decides to actually turn. Which makes trying to dive the kite interesting as you have to make it dive down and then correct for it before it gets too close to the water.

Is this normal? Its an older kite, so maybe the newer big kites can turn faster?

It doesn't have other attachment points for the bridle, so I guess there's no way to adjust it, but is it going to be any better with a newer kite of the same size or are they all going to be so slow. This thing is like being towed behind the Hindenburg, which is fine until it falls out of the sky like it did when the wind dropped off today.

Plummet
4862 posts
27 Feb 2019 1:00AM
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No, you can't get a fast turning big kite there are all slow. But some are faster than others.

Also turning speed is relative to what you call fast. In my book an 11m is slow as hell compared to my 8m and my 8m turns like a freaken bus compared to my 4m!

cauncy
WA, 8407 posts
27 Feb 2019 5:58AM
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Ever seen a fat chick do the hundred under 12 seconds

FormulaNova
WA, 14049 posts
27 Feb 2019 6:29AM
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Plummet said..
No, you can't get a fast turning big kite there are all slow. But some are faster than others.

Also turning speed is relative to what you call fast. In my book an 11m is slow as hell compared to my 8m and my 8m turns like a freaken bus compared to my 4m!


Yes, I can understand that. I have a 9m as well and its much faster, but not that different to the 11m. The 14m is really slow in comparison though. I also have a 17m at home, so it sounds like I need to fly that and compare. Its 10 years younger than the 14m, so I would expect it might be better for turning despite the increased size.

quikdrawMcgraw
1221 posts
27 Feb 2019 8:04AM
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Yeah they not really meant to turn fast are they ?the pull power is in the size of them,
The difference between the 9 and 11 wouldn't be that much naturally, but a 14 m used is used in -15 knots so can't possibly moved fast through the whinge window

eppo
WA, 9372 posts
27 Feb 2019 10:21AM
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difference between a 9 and an 11 is normally very noticeable as at the 10m mark they move into the big kite category design needs.


9m is that changeover size between small and large...normally.

as far as a 14m goes...well that also depends on the type of kite. For instance the airush Union in a 14m size is relatively quick. A 14m rebel is a truck.

quikdrawMcgraw
1221 posts
27 Feb 2019 10:56AM
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What size is the bar you use

smook
VIC, 196 posts
27 Feb 2019 2:04PM
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I love my v4 or V5 12 m Reo it turns like 10 m and have used it One Eye and INDO I have 17 Zephyr V5 and it definitely turns better than older models And yes I also send fax Trying to get 14 m Enduro v2 to try against Zephyr and 12 m Reo

wishy
WA, 1501 posts
27 Feb 2019 11:05AM
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Really short lines will make it turn faster but then you have a shorter power stroke and less good wind hitting it at a lower altitude.

Ozone Kites Aus
NSW, 884 posts
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27 Feb 2019 3:20PM
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wishy said..
Really short lines will make it turn faster but then you have a shorter power stroke and less good wind hitting it at a lower altitude.


Sorry, Wishy that's just not true. A slow turning kite will not turn quicker on short lines, it may seem like it does but that's because its wind window is smaller, so it travels from one side of the window to the other faster because the distance is shorter. The downside of short lines is decreased power stroke and the ability to work the kite.
The design of the kite is what makes it slow, as well as the physical size. You cannot make a prime mover truck turn and handle like a go-kart.
The early Contra kites were very slow, the later models are on par with similar sized kites.
14M and above normally require a longer bar too, make sure you have a bar that's at least 55cm long on your 14M old Contra, even a 60cm could make a difference, but if its a 10yo Contra, then its just plain slow and there is nothing you can do except retire it and get a modern 14M or larger kite for low winds.

eppo
WA, 9372 posts
27 Feb 2019 1:08PM
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smook said..
I love my v4 or V5 12 m Reo it turns like 10 m and have used it One Eye and INDO I have 17 Zephyr V5 and it definitely turns better than older models And yes I also send fax Trying to get 14 m Enduro v2 to try against Zephyr and 12 m Reo


Yeh reos are lightning fast but it's not really in the same design mould. I reckon an enduro from my time on it would be worth checking out because of its C but again even that is not in the contra style

wishy
WA, 1501 posts
27 Feb 2019 3:05PM
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Ozone Kites Aus said..

wishy said..
Really short lines will make it turn faster but then you have a shorter power stroke and less good wind hitting it at a lower altitude.



Sorry, Wishy that's just not true. A slow turning kite will not turn quicker on short lines, it may seem like it does but that's because its wind window is smaller, so it travels from one side of the window to the other faster because the distance is shorter. The downside of short lines is decreased power stroke and the ability to work the kite.
The design of the kite is what makes it slow, as well as the physical size. You cannot make a prime mover truck turn and handle like a go-kart.
The early Contra kites were very slow, the later models are on par with similar sized kites.
14M and above normally require a longer bar too, make sure you have a bar that's at least 55cm long on your 14M old Contra, even a 60cm could make a difference, but if its a 10yo Contra, then its just plain slow and there is nothing you can do except retire it and get a modern 14M or larger kite for low winds.


That makes sense , I guess it seems more responsive but thats only cos its not moving very far.

smook
VIC, 196 posts
27 Feb 2019 6:52PM
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eppo said..

smook said..
I love my v4 or V5 12 m Reo it turns like 10 m and have used it One Eye and INDO I have 17 Zephyr V5 and it definitely turns better than older models And yes I also send fax Trying to get 14 m Enduro v2 to try against Zephyr and 12 m Reo



Yeh reos are lightning fast but it's not really in the same design mould. I reckon an enduro from my time on it would be worth checking out because of its C but again even that is not in the contra style


I was only going to use 12 m to get a feel in difference in turning to the other kites and also use different volume surf boards to try to find the sweet spot for Board volume / kite turning / light wind kiting

EastCC
QLD, 354 posts
27 Feb 2019 6:13PM
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Ocean Rodeo Flite 14.5 and 17 turn quickly for bigger kites, but big kites are big kites.

The Contra I tried a while back was def on the slowish side, I don't think there is too much you can do about it.

A 60cm bar, do people use such a beast? You'd need to keep it a seat in the car.

Duff15
VIC, 249 posts
27 Feb 2019 8:22PM
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The biggest kite I own is a 9m turns fast. My 5m is a speed demon. But I'm a foiler.

raggedflyer
WA, 64 posts
27 Feb 2019 9:08PM
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The 2016 Zephyr moves reasonably quickly for a big kite with the 55cm bar & 27m lines, when I want it to change direction quicker I'll pull one of the steering lines to get it to pivot and I've been impressed with it in 12-15kt winds when guys on 12 & 14's are struggling.

FormulaNova
WA, 14049 posts
27 Feb 2019 9:56PM
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Ozone Kites Aus said..


The design of the kite is what makes it slow, as well as the physical size. You cannot make a prime mover truck turn and handle like a go-kart.
The early Contra kites were very slow, the later models are on par with similar sized kites.
14M and above normally require a longer bar too, make sure you have a bar that's at least 55cm long on your 14M old Contra, even a 60cm could make a difference, but if its a 10yo Contra, then its just plain slow and there is nothing you can do except retire it and get a modern 14M or larger kite for low winds.


Yes, its an old Contra, 2006 I think, even though its in good nick. I guess who ever owned it did not use it much.

One of the things I neglected to mention was that it came with a pulley 2:1 bar, i.e. the bar has pulleys on the end to effectively double the throw of the bar. I am not using that at the moment and have it on a 55cm Ozone bar. I can imagine that the extra throw of the pulley bar would make it react a little faster, but right now I am really just exagerating the movements on the Ozone bar. I think my technique is developing as I get used to it.

I am now keen to try my more modern 17m Ozone, but its not with me right now.

quikdrawMcgraw
1221 posts
28 Feb 2019 7:33AM
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Where did you find it



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"Can a big kite turn quickly?" started by FormulaNova